Time for some shenanigans. |
Hello my wonderfully
coloured spiney friends! In today's tactica I will be reaching out to
my squiggly alien brothers and sisters to pass over some of the
knowledge and craft I have collected while playing with the
confusing, but excellent, Shaltari. I will be going through do's and
dont's, a breakdown of most of the units available to us and a few
hints and tips for deployment and mission trickery.
For UCM, PHR, Scourge and Resistance overviews just click
For UCM, PHR, Scourge and Resistance overviews just click
This is going to be a
very long one, so pull up a seat, cushion or whatever it is Shaltari
sit on (who knows, as they are covered in spines they may just stand
all the time...) and open your mindholes!
Overview
Out of all the races in DzC the Shaltari are by far the most
complicated to play and difficult to master. Not only will you
confuse yourself sometimes but if you are playing against an opponent
who doesn't know the rules they are sure to look at your movement in
the same way a 3 year old stares at the removable thumb trick; with
confusion, disbelief and fear. To back their strange movement
patterns up we also have the least threatening gun line, and the
worst armour.
'So why would I play this, awkward, weak race Zombie?' I hear you
ask! Well once you master the art of manoeuvrability and counter
attack the Shaltari become a very potent force which is ridiculously
hard to stop, that's why! And never question me again! Erhum,
moving on...
As mentioned in my previous tactica posts this game is about
objectives rather than kill points and as such Shaltari hold the
greatest threat off all the races to claim them, whether it be normal
objectives, pieces of intel or focal points. This is all due to our
gates. If you are using the right number of gates, and have planned
correctly, it is possible to literally jump your units all over the
board. For example, the other night I moved a braves squad over 40
inches to aid another in a CQB (I must admit this move caused my
opponent to turn the air around the table a little blue, but that
comes with the army!). There is literally no other race that can do
this! Having an even spread of gates across the table, or the
opportunity to bring some in from the mothership (from readiness) via
Eden's or Gaia's, will greatly increase your chances of catching your
opponents out and ultimately winning games. Also don't try to commit
your points in having enough gates to move your whole army in one
turn. Having 4 or more Eden's in an army is a waste of points, and
I'll explain why a little later on.
The weapons on our vehicles are typically energy 10 which in the DzC
universe is fairly standard, but the one problem is we don't tend to
have too many of them. In addition to this we don't have the
abundance of 'special' weaponry that other races do. As such in most
game situations to go on the aggressive with our tanks and walkers
would be suicide and we must stay a little more compact than other
races and pick our shots more carefully. With a Shaltari army I have
found it is better to focus your fire on one enemy who has more than
1DP to make sure it has gone, rather than split between 3 or 4 and
play the odds. For example, if I have 6 Tomahawks and my opponent has
2 Gladius I will fire all 6 into one. Splitting fire and doing 1DP to
each tank is all well and good, but that is still four E11 shots
coming back rather than two. When picking targets I tend to go for an
enemies AA first, as our gates are very vulnerable and even our
skimmers can be hurt by most AA. If I had to choice of removing three
sabres or three rapiers, I will choose the rapiers every time.
Although our armour is weak, we do boast a 5+ passive save on
everything (bar troops). Using this, along with skimmer bonuses,
means that you can play a touch cautiously but as soon as your dice
abandon you your models will leave the table with terrifying speed.
Staying hidden and forcing the enemy to play where you want them is
key. Remember not to be too eager in moving forward. If you don't get
to shoot a unit in a turn don't fret over it, it will normally mean
you can't be shot back. One weapon which you can't escape from
however are indirect fire blast weapons and they should be avoid at
all costs. Two Longbows will give any of our skimmers a really bad
day! As they only 'miss' on a 1, even a bad scatter normally results
in 1 or 2 still being hit. I regularly curse the day Longbows were
introduced (damn you Dave!).
Abuse the manoeuvrability of out troops by spreading your gates wide
Don't over spend on gates
Avoid getting drawn into fire fights
Pick your targets carefully – target AA first
Overkill is underrated
Be patient and not over-eager
The Units
Command:
Coyote (edit 17/06/16) – As the first command choice released the Coyote feels a little dated now, but still remains a viable choice if you prefer a more defensive army build. It boasts two E10 guns which will allow him to pick of the odd
tank, and with a 4+ passive save should take a shot or two back. He is however only Armour 9 and if you fail a few saves can go down pretty quickly, so he is best
used as a back field unit. His command pod ejection is a pretty
useful rule but if it has got far enough for it to be used you are probably already
losing... I always walk mine on and take a shot or two at a building
in the first turn. As he doesn't need to be half way across the
battlefield on the first turns so using a gate on him is a waste, and he
can always be brought forward later if you want to. Due to this deployment method you will likely need to field Scouts with the Coyote, in order to benefit from his CV bubble.
Pro's:
Useful for picking off enemy light tanks
Will ignore enemy fire 50% of the time
Won't be a priority to your opponent due to the 4+ passive save
Con's:
Only Armour 9
Lacks any kind of Utility
Fairly static without using gates
Standard:
Fairly static without using gates
Standard:
Tomahawk – I have a little bit of a hate/hate relationship with my
Tomawhawks. For so long they were the only standard tank
available, and as such you had to have them. My problem with the
unit is that three are a waste of time and don't kill anything, so
you have to have five or six otherwise you are technically wasting points.
Further on from that, I have had games where they have literally done
nothing as they need a 5+ to kill most things. Having said this,
their skimmer bonus and passive save make them a little more robust
than you would think, and their speed is great for counter attacks.
Also double tapping (using them as a last activation, and then as a
first on the subsequent turn) the unit can be pretty effective as it
equals to 12 E10 shots with a six strong unit.
Pro's:
Speedy; good for flanking and counter attacks
If driven on in the first turn good for stripping a building off a
few DP
Skimmer bonus
Con's:
Not worth taking less than 6
Vulnerable to shooting at A7, even from most AA
Tarantula (edit 17/06/16) – These were the babies I had been waiting for, and they were worth the wait! I can now field a war of the worlds army, and as
long as I have a kleenex and some Lemsip handy no germs are going to
get in my way! They have great guns (which equal out to around E11
against most armour) and with a 6” MV value are pretty nippy too.
In addition to this their jack in the box climber special rule is
pretty sweet, all be it very situational (I would be VERY wary about
getting on buildings when up against a demo army). They do however die when
shot back, and are about as survivable as a Tomahawk. True, they are armour 8 and have 2 DP but E11 guns
double on a 4+, and there is a lot of it knocking about these days. You also don't get the skimmer bonus so most guns hit
on a 2+. I would tend to get these guys out on turn 2 to be ready to
fire on turn 3, as this means you could be where you need to be
without being shot back. Also I know a lot of people run these with a
Dreamsnare to increase their survivability, but I don't like the idea
of having to pay a 'Dreamsnare tax' on the unit. This is more
personal preference than anything else though.
Pros:
Killer gun against beefy targets
Handy second gun; E7 microlaser is useful for nicking DP's of
transports, light tanks and buildings
Quick at MV 6”
Con's:
Super vulnerable
Support:
Kuri – These tanks in my opinion are some of the best support AA tank in
the game. Although the gun only has an 18” range and is E6, most
aircraft are only A5, and you will find twelve dice from a
full strength unit will deal with most targets. Having four shots
also makes reaction fire far more reliable, especially if you have
the assisted targeting card which lets you re-roll misses from one
gun (not just one miss, ALL the misses). They also have a MV value of
6” so have an effective kill range of 24” in their activation. As
with the Tomahawk though they are vulnerable to being shot.
Pro's:
Excellent AA. Nuff said.
Con's:
Vulnerable
Birdeater (edit 17/06/16) – Designed on the Tarantula's frame, the Birdeater gives you the option of fielding an all walker list (cue Jeff Wayn) if that tickled your fancy. As an AA squad the Birdeater falls short of being as good as the Kukri, but after recent points changes to the Shaltari army as a whole these cheeky chappies are good value, and will sneak into lists where a squad of Kukris won't. The climbing rule is transferred over from the Tarantula, and is actually far more useful on an AA unit due to aircraft being 6" in the air!
Pro's:
Quick at MV6"
Can climb walls to gain advantage
Con's:
Vulnerable due to low armour
Low number of shots for an AA squad
Birdeater (edit 17/06/16) – Designed on the Tarantula's frame, the Birdeater gives you the option of fielding an all walker list (cue Jeff Wayn) if that tickled your fancy. As an AA squad the Birdeater falls short of being as good as the Kukri, but after recent points changes to the Shaltari army as a whole these cheeky chappies are good value, and will sneak into lists where a squad of Kukris won't. The climbing rule is transferred over from the Tarantula, and is actually far more useful on an AA unit due to aircraft being 6" in the air!
Pro's:
Quick at MV6"
Can climb walls to gain advantage
Con's:
Vulnerable due to low armour
Low number of shots for an AA squad
Thunderbird (edit 17/06/16) – Gunships in DzC started out being too expensive, and
even with the multiple points drop this unit still doesn't cut, spread or even
spoon out the mustard for me. One E10 shot, 3+ to hit, 1 DP, A5. After erratas it also now has E2 countermeasures, but the problem the Thunderbird will always have is it's E10 gun. In the current climate they are simply not an efficient unit. Dare I say it, I would rather
have a Tomahawk. At least that hits on a 2+...
Pro's:
It is very manoeuvrable with a movement of 20”
Con's:
Weak armour and 1 DP
One E10 is not enough in a fire fight
Firedrake – The daddy of gates, this boy is pure class. Sure, he
will cost 130 points, but having a 48” small template is
unbelievable! On turn one he can fly on and take a pop shot at a tank
who has driven on, or even at something like the Ferrum. As he only
really misses on a roll of a 1, a 2 only scatters the blast 1” inch
which will be enough to hit something (it is worth keeping assisted
targeting cards handy for any 1's rolled). Also the closer you get to the
enemy the larger the blast becomes, which can be brutal on a unit so manoeuvrable!
The gun is only E10 however, and sometimes it will do
nothing for full games. It also boasts a second weapon, which can either shoot tanks (poorly) or target Infantry (very well). Against Scourge and especially
Resistance though this is a must have unit and will cause all kinds of
problems. Oh yeh, I almost forgot, if you like it can be the
equivalent of an Eden gate for a turn if you need it. With the expense of gates these days, this can be a very useful tool indeed.
Enormous range on a quality gun
Can MV10” so manoeuvrable
Has 5 DP and A5 so pretty survivable
Can be used as a gate if need be
Con's:
Not a cheap unit, you do pay for the awesomeness
Dreamsnare (edit 17/06/16) – This is a unit that is loved by a lot of Shaltari
players and I can see why. The ability to take passive save from a
1/3 chance to a ½ chance is not to be ignored! You must be within 6” of this model for this bonus to apply
though (measured as shooting, so centre to centre not model to model)
and I feel this is a little restrictive on an armies width. The urge
to hide your army within 6” is very tempting and it means you could
end up getting flanked very easily. The bonus of a Dreamsnare in the current meta though is how strong an anti-Infantry tool it is, as it can pump out 24 E4 shots! I think for a starting player this unit can be very
useful while you get to grips of the frailty of Shaltari, but once
you get to a more advanced stage of playing that you should leave it
behind and expand on army selection. Controversial I know, but
remember I'm not saying that this unit is bad, but I think it is far
from an auto-include.
Pro's:
4+ passive save for all within 6” is awesome
Great anti-Infantry pressence
Great anti-Infantry pressence
Con's:
Could be tactically restrictive
Hard to find points in a list for what it offers in return
Totem Warspire (edit 17/06/16) – When this imposing monolith was first realised I saw no value in it whatsoever, but oh how my opinion has changed. Firstly, it is only 50 points; bear this in mind for what I'm about to run through! The Totem is a multi-utility unit, which means in Dropzone it is worth its weight in gold. It will hold focal points well (it is awkwardly robust), snipe aircraft with AA, comfortably take out tanks with an E12 shot, and on top of this summon a protective shell around a building within range to give it a P5+ save! Granted, the AT shot and Passive shield is an alt weapon, but that won't normally be an issue. All this for 50 points! The downside is that you will always be deploying a Totem through a gate, and this must be taken into account in both your army list and also your first turn deployment. This said, it's not too much of a problem as it posseses the Lightning Reflexes special rule, so can shoot on the turn of deployment. Yah, it's pretty mad. The one and only drawback is that Shaltari support slots are limited, so it can be a squeeze to fit it in with some of your other toys.
Pro's:
E12 shot shouldn't be ignored
Shielding buildings can be useful
Lightning Reflexes and AA is totally badass
Lightning Reflexes and AA is totally badass
Con's:
Can be tricky to squeeze in a support slot
Sometimes it can be very situational
Firebird (edit 17/06/16) – The Firebird is a bit like a miracle child that survived a tricky birth, and now receives all the attention from its parents. I'm sorry Thunderbird, but your just not as special.
Firebird (edit 17/06/16) – The Firebird is a bit like a miracle child that survived a tricky birth, and now receives all the attention from its parents. I'm sorry Thunderbird, but your just not as special.
Heavy:
Jaguar – We are very lucky to have this unit, as it is in my
opinion the best or joint best (with the Ferrum) utility unit in the
game. It has 2 E10 shots and 4 E6 AA shots, as well as 4 DP, all for
100 points. I run 2 together, as having 8 AA shots is incredibly
useful and negates the need for an extra unit of Kukris's. It also
makes an effective firebase and they hold mid-table very well. The
downside? A9. Once a shot gets through it isn't too hard to double up
against the Jag, so keep your field repair cards handy.
Pro's:
Has effective AA and decent enough anti-tank guns
A big prensense in the middle of the table
Con's:
A touch vulnerable to enemy fire, and these bad boys WILL get shot at
Ocelot – Now here is a unit who has nothing to prove downstairs!
The Ocelot features the most terrifying gun in the game and if used
right you can blow holes out of anything you point it at. It blows
down buildings like they were made of twigs, ignores passive saves,
it can one shot heavy PHR walkers and shoots forever! It doesn’t do
anything else though which may not seem like a problem but if those
one's turn up when rolling one dice a turn it will drive you crazy.
It also can't move and shoot so can be avoided reasonably easy. I'm
not sold on units which roll one dice as that 1/6 chance can really
bite you in the arse, but I do see the good in the Ocelot too.
Shaltari don't do building demo well and this brings the skill in
buckets. Also one turning a Zeus is hilarious.
Pro's:
Super wicked bad electric bitching laser of death
Con's:
All it has is the super wicked bad electric bitching laser of death,
and it doesn't contribute in any other way at all
It can't move and fire
Caiman – I am glad that this unit has been released, as it seems to
be what a lot of players have been waiting for. It has a superb MV
value for a heavy and should always one turn a standard tank, or at
least give a bigger target something to worry about. Have two in an
army then Hades and Ferrum's can start to worry a little. They also
have a 36” range which is great. Once shot back though you have to
start being careful as they are only A7 and 4 DP; they suffer the
same problem as all Shaltari skimmers, in that AA can hurt them. Also
it isn't very often that an enemy will be outside of 24” so the 36”
range may become a little irrelevant. Not that I want to pile hate on
this unit but it's guns are only E10, so with slightly under average
rolls you will fail to kill simple units like a Sabre. In my opinion,
the gun should have been E11 with a 24” range. This would make it a
real killer and you would be almost guaranteed to get a kill a turn
with it. All in all, I won't be swapping out my Jag's for Caiman's
and they are too expensive to have both in a balanced list.
Pro's:
Huge range
Should 1 turn basic tanks
Speedy for a heavy unit
Con's:
Suffers the Shaltari's skimmer weaknesses
E10 guns are just not quite good enough.
Scouts:
Yari – The one and only choice for us, which is a little annoying
as they damned expensive (27 points for one with a worthwhile gun).
For this reason I expect a lot of people don't include them in a
list, but unless not possible I would always take 2-3 along. Yes, 3
cost 81 points which seems obscene for 3 paper thin tanks, but being
able to have an SoI on the opposite board side as your commander is
so, so useful. They work very
well with both scout gate drone cards and they tend to be a very low
priority on your opponents target list. In addition to this having a
handful of additional AA shots can be so useful. 3 E6 AA shots will
kill a standard troop aircraft no problem, and in fact at Invasion
2014 my 3 Yari's shot down two Raven's (killing a full squad of
Legionnaires in the process) effectively sealing me a win. As noted
by many the microwave gun is a waste so I would ignore this option
and always opt for the AA, which is a shame really. Don't over look
these guys due to cost, they have the ability to win games for you.
Pro's:
Scouts, so SoI increase
With AA can grab cheeky kills
So damn quick!
Con's:
Will die when shot, gauranteed
For scouts they are expensive
Troops:
I'm going to throw both the Braves
and Firstborns into one section as they are very similar, and are
both the best troops in the game. They are very tough at A4, aren't
normally bothered by falling masonry and have active counter measures
against E6 weapons or less (useful when lining walls). The Braves
have an E9 shot per base which is useful, and the Firstborns are
beasts in combat. The bad news is they only have 3dp per base, so any
lucky falling masonry can really hurt the dice in CQB.
Pro's:
Toughest of all the troops
Good in CQB
Con's:
Few DP per base
I'm not going to go into fast movers
and gates, as there isn't too much need to. The Warspear is
overpriced and to random to consider outside of the most friendly of
friendlies, and gates are unit specific so choice in an army will
differ.
My
list and why
The list I took to Invasion 2014 was
as below (Feb releases were not available at this point, hence the
Tomahawks). The list was balanced enough and had enough punch to help
me win the tourney. There are small amendments I will be making, most
notably the removal of the Tomahawk's for 4 Tarantulas, but I am very
happy with the general structure.
Gates:
Eden
Eden
Spirit
Spirit
Haven
Haven
Haven
Haven
Court of Elders:
Coyote (Warchief CV4)
Firstborns
Swordpoint:
3 x Kukri
6 x Tomahawk
Warrior Clan:
Braves
Braves
Warrior Clan
Braves
Firedrake
Warfist:
Jaguar
Jaguar
Speartip:
3 x Yari (Light Ion Cannon)
Total = 1499
You'll probably notice my gates look
a little different to as on most lists you may have seen. I have four
Haven's simply because I had been using the old, more expensive cost
of the Firstborns from 1.0 rules and realised I had 16 points spare
about a month pre-torunament (schoolboy error I know...). This turned
out to be a blessing in disguise, as having four Havens meant I could
have fine mass gates literally wherever I wanted, assuming of course
my Edens were alive. Four may be too many but I would always take at
least three. As this is an objectives game they bring so many options
to the table! Also as you have to activate at least one gate per
battlegroup on the first turn it meant I could drive on two thirds of
my army and not worry about having to deploy the Jag's from the Edens
before I did anything else (remember activating a unit doesn't mean
it has to enter the table, and they can be kept on the mothership
until you need them).
Two spirits is pretty standard. When
using them in focal point missions don't be afraid to keep them of
the table until turn 4/5. They move 30” so can get to wherever you
need them late game, and if you have dealt with the enemy AA they
have free reign of the table.
I only have 2 Edens which may seem
like too few but I only gate my Jag's on. My Tomahawk's, Coyote,
Kukri's and Yari's all drive on. This means the E10 guns can shoot
buildings and the AA is quick enough to get where it needs to be on
turn 2. As I don't normally want to be leaving my table half gating
more units on is a waste of time and points, and I can always pull my
boss forward on turn 2 if I want. When I mentioned earlier about
spending more than necessary on gates this is why. It is your troops
that will need the manoeuvrability and not so much your tanks. If you
protect your gates by hiding them at the back on turn 3 or 4 they can
make 20” moves to where you want them.
This brings me to The Fling.
Focal point missions are the
toughest for us. They force us to go into the enemies dirty, horrible
half of the board to get big wins. Driving up the table is folly
unless you want to be shot, and getting your troops in focal points
to early can lead to all kinds of problems. It is problems like this
in which the Shaltari's manoeuvrability is key, and must be abused to
the limits.
To simply describe this manoeuvre in
turn 4 or 5 start to move your Eden's towards the enemies table half,
keeping one held back in your deployment zone. On turn 5 or 6 you
then want to activate your boss (or a similar unit) with 2 gates,
jump him into one and out of the other which you have moved onto your
adversaries focal point. This move will teleport your unit from an
unassuming point to the heart of their defence, and they will be left
with very little time to do anything about it. A CV4 boss is worth a
stonking 205 VP's and will typically hold any point you stick him on.
This also works well with troops by using Havens and Spirits. Timing
is key in this manoeuvre as if you leave it too late it can cost you
the game, and too early your boss and his SoI. Luring your opponent
to think your boss is holding one of your focal points so they don't
bother with it, only to leap him 40” and win it with a solitary
Haven is as fun as it gets for a Shaltari player!
This move can easily be done with
two Edens but I also have a Firedrake if need be. Without the
Firedrake I would consider 3 Edens, but to be honest I haven't tested
this so am not sure if the points spent on the third Eden is a waste
or not.
Deployment
Good deployment is key to winning in
DzC, and here is an overview of how I would deploy against an
adversary, race dependant.
UCM:
A strong deep, wide line is enough
to typically keep the UCM at bay. I will normally use my large unit
of standard tanks to pick off a unit of unguarded Rapiers, and then
move them more central to link up where they are needed.
PHR:
I will typically deploy to one side
of the battlefield, and try to leave the activation of my big tank
units last to gauge where theirs will be to limit damage the most. On
the opposite side my Yari's will run on their own to increase my SoI
as they are not a big threat to the PHR. They can pick of Triton's
though if lucky which can be handy.
Scourge:
Deploying in a more deep central
block will help with the in your face, up your arse nature of the
Scourge. Once beating of the initial attack you can expand up to
middle of the field and pick of what is left.
Shalari: I have never played against
Shaltari, so this is pure speculation! Positioning AA on the flanks
will most likely help take out sneaky Eden's and spirits, damaging
their manoeuvrability.
And there you have it! If you have
made it this far I hope you have learnt something that will help you
in the grand manipulation of your sluggish foes. Please leave
comments and feedback for anything that you don't agree with or would
like a more specific look into, I am happy to help as best I can!
Toodles!
Really interesting post! I think the Shaltari can be very strong when played right but also extremely hard to actually get right. I think most people overspend on the gates, though. It would be interesting to see an analysis on the basic principles of the Shaltari as well. Since they are hard to play an basis on the strange tactics you can employ as well as a basic tutorial on the Q/A with the Shaltari (can you move a gate within 6" if flying low and so on). Since DZC is still in it's infant such an article would be very interesting for people like me that doesn't get many games against Shaltari back home.
ReplyDeleteCheers for the feedback! I could possibly do a more specific tactica aimed towards missions though it can be very tricky to advise on a game by game basis, due to the variability of opponents army choices. Food for thought though!
DeleteOn another note... on my blog I found people have a tendency to read more on the blog if there are smaller articles. You have a lot of great material here but it wouldn't have damaged it (on the contrary, actually) if you would have split it up on three or even four parts. Just write the entire article and release it in small parts (don't write one part and release that then write next part) the best articles I got out was when the entire article was written and then divided and time-scheduled over, say two weeks. that means you can actually post when the next part will be released, causing some hype and a "tune in the next time for more of this". Expectations, man! Doing this builds a lot more expectations.
ReplyDeleteNote, this is only whining because I think reading a lot is a bit awkward on a blog and after one read it is all over. But if it is divided I get that "cool, I'll check in on that date to get more"-feeling I personally like.
Let me clarify that: the article was great but one read and then it is over - let the readers enjoy the expectations as well!
ReplyDeleteI hear you buddy, this was more of a 'one off' tactica and it was written to be in one place if needed. My future posts will be a little more staggered, but I do appreciate the input!
DeleteReally helpful thanks, can't wait to get my shaltari on the table. Planning on going to a few tourneys this year as well
ReplyDeleteVery exciting! Thank you so much for the detailed post! One question ( a noobie question at that) now that your planning to replace the tanks with walkers, do you envisage requiring more gates to negate their lack of manuevorability in comparison to the skimmers?
ReplyDeleteAlso curious - what would you recommend for a starting 500 points? Is the small Shaltari Starter Set any use competitively speaking vs the other starter sets?
DeleteI have played a few games using the Tarantulas instead of Tomahawks now, and they definitely affect my deployment by quite a bit. I have literally switched out the 6 hawks for 4 spideys and where I would normally have driven my hawks on and shot at a building with them, I am instead bringing the spideys through my two Eden's on turn 2 and depositing them behind a large building ready to jump on someone for turn 3. Getting the most out of the Tarantulas is not easy and you really need to know your army well. When they work though, they decimate! They have 3 Phobos and 3 Odins kills in 2 games so far!
ReplyDeleteThis means I have also had to adjust how I deploy my Havens. I would normally have brought them through the Eden's in turn 2, but as they are preoccupied I bring them through the Firedrake in turn 1. This doesn't limit my maneuverability as I have 2 spirits that can jump to the other side of the board if need be, but does mean I can't have a cheeky template shot on turn 1 (which to be fair typically only kills one thing if I'm lucky)!
In my opinion I thin the Shaltari starter set is the best out of the lot! You will use all the gates (unlike in the other three where the land APC's don't get a look in), the Kukri's and the Jaguar too. The Tomahawks worth learning with as well, although may not stay in your list for long. Also I personally don't think it is worth taking less than 6 either so you would potentially have to buy another blister.
Cheers for the insights! Extremely helpful indeed! I have to say after doing a fair bit of research into the Shaltari the more I'm thinking that you've really cracked how they should function! I've purchased a 1500 army along very similar lines to yours, just got to learn how to put it all together on hurt battlefield now but your article above will be of great great help, sir! Thank you once again :)
ReplyDeleteYou are very welcome, and I'm glad I can help! If you have anymore questions just pop them over, they can be useful for others who are thinking the same thing to read.
DeleteCheers man :) Gonna get my paint on over the next week or so. Im sure there will be some questions along the way once the games start :D
DeleteHello zombiestate, newcomer here just starting out. i found this very insightful. I wrote a list based on the what you said only i gave it a more walker theme, do you think this could be a good start?
ReplyDeleteFirst Draft
Clash: 1497/1500 points
Standard Army
Standard Roster [1497/1500 pts]
Gate Group [230 pts]
Eden Gates: 2x Eden [90 pts]
Spirit Gates: 2x Spirit [80 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Court of Elders [301 pts]
Coyote: Coyote(Warchief) [205 pts]
Firstborns: 2x Firstborns [96 pts]
Swordpoint [336 pts]
Tarantula Squad: 4x Tarantula [220 pts]
Birdeater Squad: 2x Birdeater [116 pts]
Warrior Clan [128 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Warrior Clan [194 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Firedrake: Firedrake [130 pts]
Warfist [200 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Speartip [108 pts]
Yari Squad: 4x Yari(+Light Ion Cannon) [108 pts]
Hey repentia, what you have there is a nice balanced list! I would recommend gating your walkers onto the battlefield, as they will be far to slow walking on. This may cause problems in what to choose to deploy first, but persevere, you'll get there! I often don't bring my Tarantulas out until turn 3.
DeleteHey thanks for the response! needed the confidence to put my money where my mouth was, gonna purchase the list tonight ^^
DeleteThe other thing im toying with in my mind is the offer they have on the site the "daves 1500pt army deal" the issue im having with it though is i dont like warspears however with the extra models u get in the box that are not in the list i came up with this, although im afraid a high warcheif in 1500 may be a huge investment. but if the list looks ok i might run with this as its a far cheaper entrance into the game. hows this?
DeleteSecond Draft
Clash: 1493/1500 points
Standard Army
Standard Roster [1493/1500 pts]
Gate Group [191 pts]
Gaia: Gaia [76 pts]
Spirit Gates: Spirit [40 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Eden Gates: Eden [45 pts]
Court of Elders [451 pts]
Coyote: Coyote(High Warchief) [255 pts]
Firstborns: 2x Firstborns [96 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Swordpoint [285 pts]
Tarantula Squad: 4x Tarantula [220 pts]
Dreamsnare: Dreamsnare [65 pts]
Warrior Clan [258 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Firedrake: Firedrake [130 pts]
Warfist [200 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Speartip [108 pts]
Yari Squad: 4x Yari(+Light Ion Cannon) [108 pts]
Your ground presence in that list would be incredible, and pretty durable too.It will be a little slow however, and could do with another unit of braves and definitely more fine mass gates. If you have a budget and this list is a fair amount cheaper, the list is far from bad. My biggest concern with it is actually the AA. Shaltari have numerous AA shots which is one of their plus points, but with only 3 Jags you will find yourself restricted due to fire rate and the speed of the unit.
DeleteA lot, to all of my advice is from a tournament point of view however, and if you are playing with friends at the moment either list should do you well!
its the diff between £140 and £217(ish) ^^ as for more braves i wish i could have no support slots to move the drake out the troops and cant put more than 3 units per battlegroup and i have the full 6 battle groups, can help the anti air issue and help some of the gate issue by dropping down the command level to warchief dropping a jaguar for bird eaters, something like this
ReplyDeleteStandard Army
Clash: 1499/1500 points
Standard Army
Standard Roster [1499/1500 pts]
Gate Group [231 pts]
Gaia: Gaia [76 pts]
Spirit Gates: 2x Spirit [80 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Haven: Haven [15 pts]
Eden Gates: Eden [45 pts]
Court of Elders [401 pts]
Coyote: Coyote(Warchief) [205 pts]
Firstborns: 2x Firstborns [96 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Swordpoint [285 pts]
Tarantula Squad: 4x Tarantula [220 pts]
Dreamsnare: Dreamsnare [65 pts]
Warrior Clan [258 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Braves: 2x Braves [64 pts]
Firedrake: Firedrake [130 pts]
Warfist [216 pts]
Jaguar Squad: Jaguar [100 pts]
Birdeater Squad: 2x Birdeater [116 pts]
Speartip [108 pts]
Yari Squad: 4x Yari(+Light Ion Cannon) [108 pts]
well could do a straight swap dropping the dreamsnare for braves moving the drake to warfist in that most recent list making room for the extra braves now that im looking at.
ReplyDeleteAnother solid list, probs better than the previous one! If you can fit 4 troops in I would advise it. I'm not really a fan of Dreamsnare, so it would be a worthwhile swap out (I am bias).
ReplyDeleteIf you have any more list inquiries just drop me a PM on the Hawk forums (http://hawkforum.co.uk/)!
Cheers man for the help man you're a legend ^^
ReplyDeleteAny updates for 2015??
ReplyDeleteYou know, I've been thinking about this over the last few weeks. When I get some extra spare time (as current spare time goes towards shiny new posts) I will definitely update this!
DeleteThank you - I look forward to any new articles!
DeleteI need a 1,000 point list to work with over the next few weeks worth of games, any thoughts? I have multiples of all of the Shaltari models and can make just about any list...
ReplyDeleteLists are a little hard to do in comments, but if you email us at obteamdzc@gmail.com I'll stick something together for you!
Delete